Thursday, December 23, 2010

From "Bah Humbug" to "Christmas is Evil" in UK

Ebeneezer Scrooge would be proud if he could read the latest story from the Daily Mail.

Outrage: The poster that has appeared in the Tower Hamlets area hitting out at the festive period

You talk about going into someone's house and defecating on the rug.

"Ya talk about chickensh--!"

Tolerance? Where is the tolerance?

Here is a link to their website and phone number.

It says to call them and find out more.

Why don't you call them and find out more?


Siarlys Jenkins said...

OK, I checked out the site. They sound like a fair number of Christian sites.

Some are more nuanced:

I could debate the sponsors of this "Christmas is evil" site. True believers of any religion start with the notion that when man defines what is moral, the bar is continually lowered. The next step of the argument is that God decides what is moral. So far, so good. We're both Methodists.

The critical point is when the sponsor of the message proclaims "God wants ME to decree and enforce what God recognizes as moral, so listen up and do what I say or else...

burning at the stake

hanging those who deny the Trinity (a European speciality)

beheading infidels

slaughtering heretics

etc. etc. etc.

That is something we have to stop, not in the name of any religion, or by denouncing any religion, but by affirming that "vengeance is mine, saith the Lord." What practitioners of any faith are called to is faithful practice, not coercion. God will judge in his own way, in his own time.

Gary Fouse said...


Yes, vengeance is mine says the Lord (when it comes to disbelief anyway). Oncly when a crime is committed against society does man step in and exact punishment. mWhat you cite about heretics and burning at the stake is valid-600 years ago. Christians today do not seek to punish disbelievers. Only one religion takes it upon themselves to authorize believers to punish apostates and behead infidels. I condemn the inquistion and all that, but let's talk about now not the Middle Ages.

Siarlys Jenkins said...

What you miss, Gary, is that most Christians live within civil societies that actively discourage the kind of religious fanaticism that many national cultures in the world still encourage or tolerate. We have many Christians who, if they found themselves in a power vacuum, would gladly institute their own version of sharia, including stoning adulterers and disobedient children. Have you forgotten the Orthodox Mormons who slit the throat of a disobedient wife?

Also, 600 years is skipping over a good deal of history. Only 400 years ago, men were hanged in Great Britain for denying the Trinity. Less than 100 years ago, children of Roman Catholic immigrants threw rocks at Jewish children and called them "Christ killers." Only 75 years ago, Lutheran pastors in Germany publicly praised Hitler for implementing some of the more angry anti-Semitic remarks Martin Luther offered, after finding that European Jews did not become instant converts to Christianity as a result of the Reformation.

Yes, at this time in world history, the faith most implicated in attempting to establish religious doctrinal domination of the secular state is Islam. But the way to be clear that we are not asking Muslims to abjure their faith is to make nonestablishment and free exercise the points of debate, rather than attacking Islam as a wicked and evil religion.