Translate

Friday, January 28, 2011

Is the US Involved in the Egyptian Uprising?

The British newspaper, The Telegraph, has an interesting story asking whether the US Government has been playing a role in the current Egyptian uprising.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/egypt/8289686/Egypt-protests-Americas-secret-backing-for-rebel-leaders-behind-uprising.html

Far be it from me to venture an opinion on this question. President Obama and his administration are stressing that the Egyptian government should respect the right of the masses to protest. Given the economic situation facing the Egyptian people and the dictatorial nature of the government, that seems reasonable. If there is going to be a regime change in Egypt, clearly the West wants to see democracy advance in the Middle East. Yet, given our experience in Iran, a dose of realism is required here. A more realistic scenario  would be that the Mubarak regime would be replaced by the Muslim Brotherhood and an Islamist regime.

If the latter is what transpires and our government played an active role in bringing an Islamist regime into power in Egypt, then the feckless performance of Jimmy Carter vis-a-via Iran would pale in comparison.

18 comments:

Anonymous said...

You know, it's really insulting and (I'll say it) racist for you to automatically assume that a Arab, Muslim-majority country is incapable of creating a legitimate democratic regime on its own.

I have yet to see you post a shred of evidence that this is an Islamist movement.

On the contrary, from what I read there are both Muslims and Copts participating in the demonstrations. They are even protecting each other during their daily prayers that they are observing during the protests.

Anonymous said...

Here's a good "tweet" for you:

"Muslim Brotherhood chanting Allah Akbar. Crowd stopped them chanting louder: Muslim, Christian, we're all Egyptian"

Anonymous said...

Here's another good one to poke a hole in your baseless nonsense:

pay attention to what the man at 0:45 is saying.

Gary Fouse said...

Anonymous(es)"You know, it's really insulting and (I'll say it) racist for you to automatically assume that a Arab, Muslim-majority country is incapable of creating a legitimate democratic regime on its own."

I await your list of democracies. Until then save your cries of racism.

I have no doubt that many or most of the protesters are motivated by the joblessness and dictatorship they live under. Yet, the Muslim Brotherhood is involved, and I predict they will come out the winners when it is all said and done. As for the Copts, perhaps you want to argue that they are not being persecuted in Egypt?

Findalis said...

Name one (1) Arab nation Anonymous that has had free open elections, isn't rife with corrupt officials for whom bribery is not only their way of life, but is protected by the government and isn't either a dictatorship or absolute monarchy? Just name one!

Gary Fouse said...

Findalis,

That's like asking Anonymous to name one planet outside of earth with automobiles.

Findalis said...

Does Arrakas count?

Siarlys Jenkins said...

Face it, Gary, there is not one thing the U.S. can do except sit and watch, like most of the rest of the world is doing.

We can't exactly depose Mubarak -- Egypt is a sovereign nation, and the fallout if he survives and we still have to deal with him would be spectacularly bad. We certainly can't move to visibly prop him up -- which would just confirm the negative opinion of the U.S. as a friend to ruthless autocrats.

All we can do is hope that the tweet Anonymous offered is accurate, and represents what is going to come out on top. What happens in Egypt... is going to start and end in Egypt. Be careful what you wish for Findalis, you might get it. Keep trying to prove it CAN'T have a Democratic outcome... or pray that it will.

Gary Fouse said...

Siarlys,

You are correct. There is precious little we can or should do here. I just hope this will show all those millions who thought Obama was the Messiah, the One that he is merely mortal.

Siarlys Jenkins said...

Of course he's mortal. Michelle tried over and over to explain that to people before the election. Kathleen Parker had some fun playing on how graphic Michelle got with that... as I recall Parker said "There is a lot of wiggle room between deification and halitosis."

If I were the President of the United States, I would say, in public, where the American people, the Egyptian government, Osama bin Laden, Nicholas Sarkozy, and everyone else in the world, could all hear it:

It is not the place of the United States of American to dictate to the people or the government of Egypt how the present crisis should be resolved. Our nation was founded by a popular revolution, and we have found that stability and the rule of law have considerable merits. We are prepared to offer our cooperation and assistance to any resolution which improves the lives of all people, ethnicities, and religious faiths in Egypt, and shows the same respect for Egypt's neighbors that we show here and now for the people of Egypt.

I understand that isn't done in diplomacy. If it was, perhaps Julian Assange wouldn't have much of an impact, no matter how many megabytes of data he is hoarding.

Gary Fouse said...

"Of course he's mortal"

You could have fooled me when he gave that "People of the world" speech in Berlin.

Gary Fouse said...

Anonymous,

I really don't care what the man at the 0:45 point is saying.

Get back to me when Egypt has a true democracy.

Ingrid said...

"Of course he's mortal"

You could have fooled me when he gave that "People of the world" speech in Berlin.

It's not his fault. I NEVER felt that he pretented to be anything but what he is, it's the people who are fools. Always were, always will be, because it is God given to look for the Messiah, and people have no clue what to look for.

Gary Fouse said...

PS To anonymous. Findalis asked you to come up with one democracy in that region, one that has ever had democracy. Have you found one yet?

Israel doesn't count.

Anonymous said...

I'm sorry, I don't speak crazy idiot, so I wasn't able to read Findalis' post. Thanks for the translation, though.

Gary Fouse said...

Anonymous,

So now that I "translated" Findalis' question to you, I assume you are preparing that list of Middle Eastern countrie that have or have ever had real democracy.

Don't worry, it's a quick task. Remember, Israel doesn't count.

Anonymous said...

That's easy: Lebanon. Or here's a better one for you: Palestine. You may not have liked the outcome in Gaza, but the elections were free and fair, and for better or for worse, the people chose Hamas. That was democracy in action.

Off the top of my head, anyways.

Siarlys Jenkins said...

It's Rush Limbaugh and Gary Fouse who are trying to deify Obama -- so they can deride him for it. Nobody else called the man "The Messiah."

OK, he made a speech to the people of the world, and Gary said "This is the voice of a god, and not of a man." Apparently Obama didn't buy that for a moment, because he has yet to meet the fate of Herod Agrippa.